Politics All about US-China Trade War

[Chazman]

China has already switched suppliers for US soya beans and US LNG ... Australia is replacing the US on LNG and south America in Soya Beans and other states

Soy beans are a global commodity. China buys from someone else, someone else buys from the US. The Chicoms need to feed 1.4 billion people. Famines spur revolutions.

 

[TIZER]

That nuclear option requires China to sit on the nuke when they press the red button. They are cheaters, but not suicidal.

push them hard enough they will do it ... don't want to say to much America/NASA has been doing the exact same things as the Chinese to help US tech companies to steal business/tech hardware/software from competitors around the globe we have Edward Snowden to thank for telling us ... the whole Huawei stuff is because US telecom companies are lagging behind Huawei that america needs to cripple Huawei ..... America is going down a dangerous route of anti free market when US companies cannot compete against foreign companies hence the threat of auto tariffs this is because American cars are to big, gas guzzlers and damn ugly .. America imposed tariffs on our pick up trucks, light trucks, and SUVs before we imposed counter tariffs on US cars .... countries are now wary of doing business with the USA, you've become unreliable you use the dollar to bully other nations and your are untrustworthy when it comes to abiding by treaties and expect the rest of us to abide by the treaty or treaties you break

name me one piece of tech US has invented ground up in the past 30 years keep in mid the Iphone/Ipad touch screen technology was developed from a Uk invented touchscreen MP3 player

 

[Chazman]

push them hard enough they will do it ...

No they won't. Because they'd be hurting themselves far worse than they'd be hurting the US.

 

[primer]

Looks like both sides have dug in. All of a sudden US manufacturers have a competitive edge and US manufacturers have never been known to not exploit competitive advantage.

What would be bad though is if they switch back. You change your suppliers and they say hey its all over go back to where things were.

The longer this thing goes the further it gets entrenched. It may come to the stage where Mexico, Vietnam fills all the space and really that's what I think they want to remove Chinese influence which is anti liberal democracy so they are really fighting an existential trade war.

China has been doing so for last few decades fighting a mercantile trade war and like Trump says must think the west was totally stupid. They have gone full Nazi in terms of politics instead of expected lib democracy. They can own everthing we will make all the rules is straight out of Mein Kampf.

 

[TheKiwi]

...

name me one piece of tech US has invented ground up in the past 30 years keep in mid the Iphone/Ipad touch screen technology was developed from a Uk invented touchscreen MP3 player

That's a silly statement. Every piece of tech is based on another earlier piece of tech.

 

[Chazman]

Looks like both sides have dug in. All of a sudden US manufacturers have a competitive edge and US manufacturers have never been known to not exploit competitive advantage.

What would be bad though is if they switch back. You change your suppliers and they say hey its all over go back to where things were.

The longer this thing goes the further it gets entrenched. It may come to the stage where Mexico, Vietnam fills all the space and really that's what I think they want to remove Chinese influence which is anti liberal democracy so they are really fighting an existential trade war.

China has been doing so for last few decades fighting a mercantile trade war and like Trump says must think the west was totally stupid. They have gone full Nazi in terms of politics instead of expected lib democracy. They can own everthing we will make all the rules is straight out of Mein Kampf.

This guy gets it.

 

[TIZER]

Beijing is considering a ban on exports of rare earth metals to the US .... that will cause massive problems for US companies especially tech companies as US will have basically no one to turn to replace Chinese rare earth metals

https://www.rt.com/business/460460-china-considering-restricting-rare-earths/

https://thehill.com/policy/finance/445812-china-considers-limiting-rare-earth-exports-to-us-report

China's government is considering plans to use the country's dominance in the rare-earth metals market against the U.S. as a trade war between the two nations progresses.

China's government is "seriously considering" restricting the export of rare metals used in electronics manufacturing to the U.S., the editor in chief of Global Times, China's party-run English-language newspaper, tweeted Tuesday, Reuters reported.

"Based on what I know, China is seriously considering restricting rare earth exports to the U.S. China may also take other countermeasures in the future," he reportedly wrote.

The Global Times, while not officially run by the federal government, is published and distributed by the Communist Party’s People’s Party, the dominant party in China.

Chinese shipments accounted for 80 percent of all U.S. imports of rare-earth minerals between 2014 and 2017, according to Reuters, suggesting that U.S. markets could be in for a major blow if the government carries out plans to restrict business to the U.S.

don't poke the Panda/Dragon

 

[TIZER]

nobody wins in trade wars .... it's like a shooting war innocent parties suffer as a consequence and nothing will ever be the same

 

[Chazman]

nobody wins in trade wars .... it's like a shooting war innocent parties suffer as a consequence and nothing will ever be the same

Maybe. Maybe not. But there are losers.

 

[TheKiwi]

Beijing is considering a ban on exports of rare earth metals to the US .... that will cause massive problems for US companies especially tech companies as US will have basically no one to turn to replace Chinese rare earth metals

https://www.rt.com/business/460460-china-considering-restricting-rare-earths/

https://thehill.com/policy/finance/445812-china-considers-limiting-rare-earth-exports-to-us-report

don't poke the Panda/Dragon

Rare Earths are only rare compared to the likes of Iron or Bauxite. The problem with them is that they're messy to extract and process which is why the west has largely outsourced them to 3rd world places like China.

But if the Chinese made dumb moves like that, they'd very quickly find that the (closed) mines in the west could be re-opened and start mining and processing again. And worse (from a Chinese perspective) the odds are very high that the western processes would be most core-efficient and reduce the overall costs of extracting them.

The Chinese tried the whole "no rare earths for you" thing back in the mid naughties and it resulted pretty much in exactly the above, with small scale (but highly efficient) mines opening in Malaysia and Australia.

To sum up, your statement is only true in the very short sense of the term.

 

[AAR Galileo]

Well extracting rare earth is really a nasty environmental stuff .That's why Western countries let China do it. You will need to change the EPA rules to reopen US mines.

 

[TheKiwi]

China is not the only third world nation out there.

 

[TIZER]

Rare Earths are only rare compared to the likes of Iron or Bauxite. The problem with them is that they're messy to extract and process which is why the west has largely outsourced them to 3rd world places like China.

But if the Chinese made dumb moves like that, they'd very quickly find that the (closed) mines in the west could be re-opened and start mining and processing again. And worse (from a Chinese perspective) the odds are very high that the western processes would be most core-efficient and reduce the overall costs of extracting them.

The Chinese tried the whole "no rare earths for you" thing back in the mid naughties and it resulted pretty much in exactly the above, with small scale (but highly efficient) mines opening in Malaysia and Australia.

To sum up, your statement is only true in the very short sense of the term.

it would take over a year China supplies 70% of the world's rare earth metals and America buys 80% of it's rare earth metals from China ... it would take years and massive investment to replace China's rare earth metals and at a much higher cost price

 

[TheKiwi]

That's where you're wrong. The substitution of alternative source rare earths in the mid-naughties was less than six months as closed mines re-opened. The price for rare earths ended up dropping as higher quality sources came on line with newer better processing. And that's what would happen again if the Chinese were dumb enough to try it. Their last attempt ended up costing them badly.

 

[TheKiwi]

Just to add to that, since 2010 when China first tried imposing controls on rare earths, the prices of them have … dropped by 85%. Clearly it was a highly successful operation by them.

 

[AAR Galileo]

China halt all soybean import from the US.

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[Buster23]

China seems to be trying so hard to make it US against the world on this trade war...

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Europe's China diplomacy seeks silver linings to US trade war
As the Chinese vice president visits Germany, the EU sees opportunities in the ongoing US-China trade war.

EU seeks silver lining to US-China trade war

As the Chinese vice president visits Germany, the EU sees opportunities in the ongoing US-China trade war.

www.aljazeera.com

 

[primer]

Have wawee manufacture in EU and transfer any tech that it developed by itself if any.

 

[Flagg]

push them hard enough they will do it ... don't want to say to much America/NASA has been doing the exact same things as the Chinese to help US tech companies to steal business/tech hardware/software from competitors around the globe we have Edward Snowden to thank for telling us ... the whole Huawei stuff is because US telecom companies are lagging behind Huawei that america needs to cripple Huawei ..... America is going down a dangerous route of anti free market when US companies cannot compete against foreign companies hence the threat of auto tariffs this is because American cars are to big, gas guzzlers and damn ugly .. America imposed tariffs on our pick up trucks, light trucks, and SUVs before we imposed counter tariffs on US cars .... countries are now wary of doing business with the USA, you've become unreliable you use the dollar to bully other nations and your are untrustworthy when it comes to abiding by treaties and expect the rest of us to abide by the treaty or treaties you break

name me one piece of tech US has invented ground up in the past 30 years keep in mid the Iphone/Ipad touch screen technology was developed from a Uk invented touchscreen MP3 player

I don’t mean to contradict you, but well, I’m going to contradict you

US intelligence services target the acquisition of competitor technology as a secondary/tertiary info requirement, but is it really anywhere near the vast industrial scale that China has been laser focused on for decades?

Of course not.

US auto manufacturing has been proven to produce high quality competitive vehicles for two decades as well, but principly for the huge US market with different customer requirements than global car markets. The biggest problem the US manufacturers had was legacy dealer networks they could not just dump(franchise laws benefitting dealers).

Claiming the US has not consistently produced world leading tech is simply not true.

Advanced semiconductors, software, medtech, biotech, pharma, and advanced turbine systems are all bastions of excellence that the US has consistently led, and continues to do so.

Risk capital(VC)was literally invented in the US and it remains the world’s epicentre of innovation investment.

Things are changing, especially with China, but your post is doom porn.

If there’s anything to be doomy about it’s:

China treating IP theft like the Manhattan Project

China/PLA/BATH(Baidu, Alibaba, Tencent, Huawei) all combined arms interoperable, whereas US/FAANG+ at each others’ throats.

That’s not tech, that’s strategy.

If you had said the US had most of the Tech and very little in the way of effective Strategy I would have agreed 100%

 

[Chazman]

Don't Panic about Rare Earth Elements

The materials used in iPhones and Tesla cars need not become a long-term casualty of a U.S.-China trade war

www.scientificamerican.com