Politics Riots in Gaza and Israel

If you are a major financer of a terrorist regime you're going to have a bad day. Hamas financer Abd Al Aziz Al Khaldi received a courtesy call today to say goodbye to his Gazan waterfront mansion. [A one hour notification phone call was given prior to the visit so his family could gather their necessities & vacate the mansion in their Roll Royces].
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Oh, I have no doubt this is the plan. I even have no doubt Iran's at the Step 4 - you think. The reality of course, is just a tiny bit more complicated.

First, there is no "surrounding". There is Hamas and Hezbollah. And after the spanking Hezzies got in 2006, they have been conspicuously almost completely quite since then (here and there half-arsed "show of force" provocations notwithstanding). Having been literally decimated in the Syrian war, their capacity, let alone the will, to fight yet another suicidal war against Israel is highly questionable. We have absolutely no illusion BTW about their missile arsenal theoretical ability to inflict damage in Israel. It's just, if this threat materializes, there will be no South Lebanon. About this nobody has any illusions either - neither us, nor them. Moreover the "surrounding" made us stronger than ever - everything from peace agreements with Arab states (new arms markets, new investment, more political clout on international arena etc.) to even more strategic cooperation with Western nations (much of it behind the curtains for obvious reasons).

Second, no. There is simply no place for nuance here - just no. As for now Iran is borderline failed state, which is painfully obvious in every aspect - anything from absolutely abysmal inflation (what was it, about 50% in 2020..?), tragically pathetic handling of Covid, to selling yourself into virtual slavery to your future Chinese masters. All this BTW, when Israel in absolutely the best shape since its establishment. Just in recent recent years Israel surpassed in its nominal GDP PP almost all major European powers - France, UK...

Third, yeah... I have no doubt that all those cheap-ass drones and speed-boats can inflict some serous damage... in a short run. The problem, of course, which again is painfully obvious to everybody, is that after you have spent decades by funding all kind of Jihadists all over the world, no much investment have left to made into your forces. The simple reality is the Iranian conventional military is a paper tiger. Remember, Mardonius, Photoshop works much better on internet, than in the real life.

Fourth. That one made me genuinely chuckle. By hardened you mean, your S**t keep mysteriously blown up ever Tuesday and Thursday. Also, sometimes, on Wednesday too. All the while Mossad keeps walking in and out of your most protected facilities like it owns the place? Shouldn't the stage four have been materialized like couple of decades ago, no?

All of this is the hard reality of what's going on, not the Iranian version of that:
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Speaking of Persian strategic thinking, mate - wonna see how it works against the Jewish mind combined with acute self-preservation instinct? The simple truth of it all, mate, we simply cannot afford to loose, and this is all. If you have any self-preservation instinct you really should start seriously considering to F*** off...

Other than that, as Bender pointed out, we'll see.

I never cherished any illusion that a simple IDF-Tanker, who at most has been involved in tactical decision-making, to have a grasp of the full strategic picture that his country is currently facing. As someone who does know what he's talking about, being fully aware of the latest discussions among the top echelon of Israel's security brass, let me try to school you.

Israel is facing an Iran that has spread its tentacles all over the Middle East. It isn't only Gaza or Lebanon, but also Syria, Iraq and Yemen. And despite attempts by both US and Israel to prevent Iran from arming all these factions to the teeth, it is clear that Iran has set up an incredible resilient and complex smuggling network that provides its regional partners with the arms and technological know-how to increasingly hit any target within Israel at will.

At the moment, Israel is facing an Hamas that has been transformed by Iran from an amateur force into a highly capable one. Back in 2001, Hamas' rockets didn't have a range more than 3 kilometre. Now, with Iranian support, they are reaching Eilat and even north of Tel Aviv. In addition, kamikaze drones are getting introduced on the battlefield that are now hitting Israel's infrastructure with pin-point accuracy. It's in the line of expectation to predict that Hamas and PIJ will only get access to more advanced weaponry as times passes, with Israel being unable to decisively deal with their rule in the Gaza Strip and with the Iranian defence industry getting more sophisticated.

And Hamas and PIJ are even the less capable groups within Iran's regional proxy network. The aforementioned factions probably have 5% of the capabilities that a completely different beast such as Hezbollah has. You know, the same Hezbollah that absolutely spanked Israel in 2006. The same IDF that failed to advance more than 6 kilometres on Lebanese territory, failing to capture even small villages like Bint Jbeil and Maroun al-Ras from numerically inferior yet determined Hezbollah fighters. With the WInograd commission, which the Israeli government issued after the conflict ended, revealing huge deficiencies within Israel's entire political and military hierarchy.

What the war in 2006 against Hezbollah uncovered, is repeating itself at the moment. The naked truth is that Israel has absolutely no clue how to deal with the likes of Hezbollah, Hamas and PIJ; organizations that have firmly entrenched themselves on its borders and are getting more lethal with every unaccountable year passing.

Now, I'm not going to deal with your other laughable claims such as that Iran is a borderline failed state, which says more about your frustration on Iran's incredible resiliency, having successfully withstand decades of the most stringiest sanctions ever placed against a nation, with a domestic security apparatus that is successfully dealing with multiple internal and external threats; etc.

Iran's nuclear industry is fully functioning, and despite Israeli actions of sabotage and targetted assassinations, which merely have had a delaying effect, Iran's technological development is firmly going forwards. Iran is at the moment introducing more advanced centrifuges (IR-9) that eventually would decrease the break-out time that Iran needs to build a nuclear weapon to only a couple of weeks. Simply put, such a leap in nuclear technology will make Iran a nuclear threshold state, with the United States not having enough time to issue a military build-up placed against the aforementioned break-out time.

I do realize though, that we are dealing with an extremely traumatic nation, with the 'Never Again' credo having been fully incorporated into Jewish national and cultural identity. The only problem is that you guys are dealing with an extremely intelligent, meticulous and focused adversary that is implementing strategic patience to eventually reach regional supremacy. In the end, the fight between Iran and Israel is going to be decided by sheer will and determination. I do not underestimate Jewish mind and survival instinct, but in the entire history of the Middle East, the Jews have been far inferior (militarily, politically, culturally, scientifically, intellectually, etc) compared to the Persians. It hasn't even been close.

Iran is going to eventually reach it's full potential and natural destiny of regional hegemon, and if that means the annulation of the State of Israel, I'm honestly pessimistic about the fortunes of the newly-born Jewish state that arrogantly established itself after forcefully uprooting Palestinians from their native lands.
 
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despite Israeli actions of sabotage and targetted assassinations

Nothing more nuisance placed against this strategic reality:

Ex-Deputy Mossad Chief Slams Netanyahu: Situation Now Is Worse Than at the 2015 Nuclear Deal​


The former deputy head of the Mossad agency said that Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu has poorly managed both the coronavirus pandemic and the struggle against the Iranian threat, in excerpts of an interview published Thursday in Yediot Acharonot.

“The bottom line was poor management. I saw poor management,” the recently retired official told Yediot in an interview set to be published in full on Friday.

Since Israel pushed for the annulment of the Iran nuclear deal, the Islamic Republic has accumulated more enriched uranium and is spreading its influence and power throughout the Middle East, “Alef” said.

“Our situation today is worse than it was at the time of the [2015] nuclear deal,” Alef said (he can still only be identified by the first initial of his name). “They didn’t stop their spread in the region for a moment. They are developing missiles… the deal we made wasn’t good; we are back to the same place.”

 
Iran has an air force? - No
Hamas - Er no
Hezbollah - thats a no
Israel has a large and modern air force of F16, F15, F35, Awacs, etc.

Nuclear weapons - in service today.

Iran - No
Hamas - no
Hezbollah - no
Israel - thought to have 80 to 400 and can deliver by aircraft, drone or cruise missile.

Tanks! Aged under 40 years?

Iran - a few russian built
Hamas - no
Hezbollah - No
Israel - 400 - built in Israel.
 

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Iran has an air force? - No
Hamas - Er no
Hezbollah - thats a no
Israel has a large and modern air force of F16, F15, F35, Awacs, etc.

Nuclear weapons - in service today.

Iran - No
Hamas - no
Hezbollah - no
Israel - thought to have 80 to 400 and can deliver by aircraft, drone or cruise missile.

Tanks! Aged under 40 years?

Iran - a few russian built
Hamas - no
Hezbollah - No
Israel - 400 - built in Israel.

Ah come on!

They got one!

1elo.webp
 
I never cherished any illusion that a simple IDF-Tanker, who at most has been involved in tactical decision-making, to have a grasp of the full strategic picture that his country is currently facing. As someone who does know what he's talking about, being fully aware of the latest discussions among the top echelon of Israel's security brass, let me try to school you.

Israel is facing an Iran that has spread its tentacles all over the Middle East. It isn't only Gaza or Lebanon, but also Syria, Iraq and Yemen. And despite attempts by both US and Israel to prevent Iran from arming all these factions to the teeth, it is clear that Iran has set up an incredible resilient and complex smuggling network that provides its regional partners with the arms and technological know-how to increasingly hit any target within Israel at will.

At the moment, Israel is facing an Hamas that has been transformed by Iran from an amateur force into a highly capable one. Back in 2001, Hamas' rockets didn't have a range more than 3 kilometre. Now, with Iranian support, they are reaching Eilat and even north of Tel Aviv. In addition, kamikaze drones are getting introduced on the battlefield that are now hitting Israel's infrastructure with pin-point accuracy. It's in the line of expectation to predict that Hamas and PIJ will only get access to more advanced weaponry as times passes, with Israel being unable to decisively deal with their rule in the Gaza Strip and with the Iranian defence industry getting more sophisticated.

And Hamas and PIJ are even the less capable groups within Iran's regional proxy network. The aforementioned factions probably have 5% of the capabilities that a completely different beast such as Hezbollah has. You know, the same Hezbollah that absolutely spanked Israel in 2006. The same IDF that failed to advance more than 6 kilometres on Lebanese territory, failing to capture even small villages like Bint Jbeil and Maroun al-Ras from numerically inferior yet determined Hezbollah fighters. With the WInograd commission, which the Israeli government issued after the conflict ended, revealing huge deficiencies within Israel's entire political and military hierarchy.

What the war in 2006 against Hezbollah uncovered, is repeating itself at the moment. The naked truth is that Israel has absolutely no clue how to deal with the likes of Hezbollah, Hamas and PIJ; organizations that have firmly entrenched themselves on its borders and are getting more lethal with every unaccountable year passing.

Now, I'm not going to deal with your other laughable claims such as that Iran is a borderline failed state, which says more about your frustration on Iran's incredible resiliency, having successfully withstand decades of the most stringiest sanctions ever placed against a nation, with a domestic security apparatus that is successfully dealing with multiple internal and external threats; etc.

Iran's nuclear industry is fully functioning, and despite Israeli actions of sabotage and targetted assassinations, which merely have had a delaying effect, Iran's technological development is firmly going forwards. Iran is at the moment introducing more advanced centrifuges (IR-9) that eventually would decrease the break-out time that Iran needs to build a nuclear weapon to only a couple of weeks. Simply put, such a leap in nuclear technology will make Iran a nuclear threshold state, with the United States not having enough time to issue a military build-up placed against the aforementioned break-out time.

I do realize though, that we are dealing with an extremely traumatic nation, with the 'Never Again' credo having been fully incorporated into Jewish national and cultural identity. The only problem is that you guys are dealing with an extremely intelligent, meticulous and focused adversary that is implementing strategic patience to eventually reach regional supremacy. In the end, the fight between Iran and Israel is going to be decided by sheer will and determination. I do not underestimate Jewish mind and survival instinct, but in the entire history of the Middle East, the Jews have been far inferior (militarily, politically, culturally, scientifically, intellectually, etc) compared to the Persians. It hasn't even been close.

Iran is going to eventually reach it's full potential and natural destiny of regional hegemon, and if that means the annulation of the State of Israel, I'm honestly pessimistic about the fortunes of the newly-born Jewish state that arrogantly established itself after forcefully uprooting Palestinians from their native lands.
I dont know why you are unable to draw logical conclusions -

If we accept as you say that Gaza houses thousands of rockets, capable of destroying Israel, why has Israel not been destroyed?

If its true, the only defence left to israel is to flatten Gaza - offer safe passage to the west bank, or the border of an Arab country and then flatten it.

Irans GDP went down 10% - and this was pre-COVID. with a large chunk going to nuclear and supporting all those rockets - which havent been used = not much left..... Surrounding a tiger, with a force of fleas, does not really impact the tiger very much. For sure a flea bite can hurt, but its not going to kill the tiger.

Iranian spend on terrorism, thought to be about $1Bn per year. Israel spends about 20bn on defense.

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To be fair, saddam lost the war to Iran with superior military technology and the backing of the west. Then again his military leaders were probably more selected according to how pleasantly they licked saddam' s as$ than on military strategy.

Well led, people with limited power have an extreme capacity to be a nuisance: Tito's partizans being another example back in WWII, otr the Soviets fighting the Afghans..or the Brits as well in the 19th century.

But it is laughable to dismiss a la @Mardonius the IDF. What he does' nt see is that the IDF does not pull all its weight. If it did, I doubt there would be courtesy calls to evacuate buildings. I don' t remember the allies doing it over German cities back in the day.
 
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Hamas is getting, what 10% of what it fires through? Same will apply to Iranian BM - we have discussed this before, you have built fixed defences, in a world of precision strike munitions. I dont doubt a few will land some blows, but it wont be enough and very few sites will launch a second strike.

Last one is a chinese weapon system.

And if the big dog actually thinks you are going to play with these weapons, you will wake up next morning with some big sand dunes where they used to be.
 
I never cherished any illusion that a simple IDF-Tanker, who at most has been involved in tactical decision-making, to have a grasp of the full strategic picture that his country is currently facing. As someone who does know what he's talking about, being fully aware of the latest discussions among the top echelon of Israel's security brass, let me try to school you.
Whoah. Do they know you are sharing secrets plans with us?
 
To be fair, saddam lost the war to Iran with superior military technology and the backing of the west. Then again his military leaders were probably more selected according to how pleasantly they licked saddam' s as$ than on military strategy.

Well led, people with limited power have an extreme capacity to be a nuisance: Tito's partizans being another example back in WWII, otr the Soviets fighting the Afghans..or the Brits as well in the 19th century.

But it is laughable to dismiss a la @Mardonius the IDF. What he does' nt see is that the IDF does not pull all its weight. If it did, I doubt there would be courtesy calls to evacuate buildings. I don' t remember the allies doing it over German cities back in the day.
I'm still waiting for a spate of 'earthquakes' in Iran........
 
Mardonius said:
I never cherished any illusion that a simple IDF-Tanker, who at most has been involved in tactical decision-making, to have a grasp of the full strategic picture that his country is currently facing. As someone who does know what he's talking about, being fully aware of the latest discussions among the top echelon of Israel's security brass, let me try to school you.

Thats the trouble with being a propogandist, you believe other people's propogandists......

Maybe he didnt understand the cruel trick the juice played by pretending to invade....
 
Well led, people with limited power have an extreme capacity to be a nuisance: Tito's partizans being another example back in WWII, otr the Soviets fighting the Afghans..or the Brits as well in the 19th century.

You are comparing apples with oranges. The Palestinian factions aren't up against expeditionary forces.

But it is laughable to dismiss a la @Mardonius the IDF. What he does' nt see is that the IDF does not pull all its weight. If it did, I doubt there would be courtesy calls to evacuate buildings. I don' t remember the allies doing it over German cities back in the day.

All these ''Israel isn't pulling all its weight'' excuses make me chuckle. You are trying to tell me that relevant constraints that Israel faces, whether militarily or politically, hamper Israel to decisively deal with militant groups that are situated at its borders and getting more lethal with every year passing, somehow is a legitimate defence in light Israel's inability to deal with these grave security threats?
 
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I'm still waiting for a spate of 'earthquakes' in Iran........

Iran has the capacity to be a real nuisance...Deep down, I hope that events in their leadership, and Israel not uselessly spiking Iranian patriotism (one of saddam' s bigger mistakes in 1980), that one day Iran and Israel could sign a peace treaty.

Peace in the Middle East is' nt Sudan or the UAE recognizing Israel, it's Israel' s stronger and more fierceful enemies ready to lay their weapons down by defeat or by understanding. Takes great leaders to do it though. And even if I don' t put any comparison between Bibi and the mullahs, I'm not sure Israel has leaders ready to do the gamble Menachem Begin took 45 years ago.

I remember seeing on TV the doubts of one of his ministers saying that as he watched the Egyptian 707 taxi to a stop at Tel Aviv, that he could still imagine some Egyptian soldiers spraying bullets towards the Israeli welcome committee as soon as the doors would open.

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...
All these ''Israel isn't pulling all its weight'' excuses make me chuckle. You are trying to tell me that relevant constraints that Israel faces, whether militarily or politically, hamper Israel to decisively deal with militant groups that are situated at its borders and getting more lethal with every year passing, somehow is a legitimate defence in light Israel's inability to deal with these grave security threats?

I'm saying Gaza could be "dresdenized" (to avoid the nuclear topic).
 
for those in artillery, why would the team leader/captain run up to your M109 and angrily throw his helmet on the ground?
watching a live M109 fire mission....
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if you watch from the 17:55 you will see what I mean...
never mind, because its live the time stamp is inaccurate
 
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Iran has the capacity to be a real nuisance

It's far more than a being a nuisance. I mean, the cries of desperation emanating from Israel with regards to the precarious strategic picture they are facing are nearly resonating all around the world.

Watch from 07:15:

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Or these comments by the former head of IDF's military intelligence, about why Israel can't use force against Iran:

“Still, Ze’evi-Farkash said using force by itself is not a long-term solution. “We cannot repeatedly attack them [like with Iraq’s and Syria’s nuclear programs]. They are too smart, have too many precision-guided missiles, and will soon have satellites to watch us just like we watch them.”


Or this interview with the head of IDF's strategic Iran Directorate:

''Kalman is also very concerned about the conventional military strengthening of Iran, which is "a discussion we're missing out on." It's not about tanks and artillery, mostly long-range missiles and rockets, many of them precise, cruise missiles, drones, advanced aerial defense weapon systems that could challenge the Israeli air force and more. "Iran doesn't only produce for itself. It supplies its subordinates with precise capabilities, with cruise missiles, with aerial defense systems to deal with Israeli air force capabilities. What's made in Iran doesn't stay in Iran. It's immediately found in Syria, Lebanon, and maybe later on in Gaza."

Q: And yet, Iran is far from surrendering.

"Iran is not a specific operational challenge, but a challenge one level above the military. It is a challenge for our national security doctrine. We had a tendency to be cynical in recent years, due to the idea that Iran is being pushed into the discussion for other things, but I really think this is about dealing with a country with the potential to become a regional power, headed by an extreme regime with a real goal of destroying Israel.

Dealing with Iran, he says, is based on four components. The first is the extreme regime, "that as long as it rules Iran, Israel will have a major challenge." The second is the nuclear issue. The third is the military strengthening "which is close to that of a regional power." And the fourth is the Iranian attempt to grow its regional influence "that in the long run uses areas with lack of governance and establishes capabilities there."

The challenge that all these pose for Israel is unprecedented. "The standard components of deterrence, defeat and defense are irrelevant for a country of 80 million people that are hundreds of miles away. This is a long-term strategic competition that calls on us to deploy a different kind of thinking than the one used for tackling a country on our border."


Q: Explain.

"For a country on our border, I build up the force, prepare for war, sometimes act to thwart threats, and I keep a very large intelligence hold , with the aim of bringing about defeat in war. With Iran, it's not about defeat. It's a competition. And therefore the components that need to be dealt with are not only military. They're also military, but also diplomatic, economic, conscientious, and more. That's how big the challenge is."

Q: Can Iran be defeated?

"When you're in a strategic competition with a state, you're not concerned about defeat. What you try to achieve is supremacy at any given point in time, supremacy that will give significant deterrence that will give you security and deter the other side from acting against you."


If one carefully read between the lines with regards to the discussions taking place among Israeli strategists, the sense of helplessness is getting significant forms. The Israelis are being out manoeuvred by Iran on every front. It won't take long - perhaps one or two generations - that the developments will eventually lead to a complete Israeli military defeat.
 
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