Warfare Russia/Ukraine War

[Chazman]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[profyler]

Putinbots keep threatening to invade Poland. I can't imagine a more epic f*ckup! Putler would end up seeking asylum in Best Korea.

If it wasn't for the killings of inocente polish people if that happens, I would sooooooo much like to see Russia humiliated and loosing all their contested territory (abkazia, transnistria, Finland border, Kuril islands etc).

 

[Mike1976]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[profyler]

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/01/world/europe/ukraine-russia-tanks.html

In an Epic Battle of Tanks, Russia Was Routed, Repeating Earlier Mistakes​

 

[Mike1976]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[TheKiwi]

....
As far as Zelensky's words being taken out of context or parsed incorrectly, what many Americans are hearing is exactly what I stated. Zelensky was trying to make a point, I agree. But after that soundbite, many Americans are thinking, F#ck You, that's enough with your bull$hit.

Having failed to make any dent in unity earlier with their rather pathetic propaganda, it's rather sad to see that Russia's latest efforts to cast Ukraine's efforts to obtain the tools to do the job as "scrounging", or "wanting your children to fight for them" getting some traction.

 

[Connaught Ranger]

Let me just play Devil's Advocate for a minute. The Ukraine-Russia war is in Europe, right? Seems to me that it is primarily a European problem. Right? Whoever controls Donbas or Crimea does not affect US security interests in the least bit. If the Ukrainian people with European support want to take them back, well then God bless them. I wish them all the luck possible.

Are we honestly saying that Russia is preparing to attack NATO now? Really? After the Ukraine debacle? They'd have to dust off their T-55s and T-34s for that. NATO has kept the Soviet Empire at bay for 3/4 of a century. It's true, that during most of that time the member nations were actual active members, doing their part. That hasn't been the case in a long time. NATO and Europe are essentially protectorates of the US. Let's face that fact. If Europe wants a wider and more intense war, they should fund it and also send their sons and daughters to fight it.


As far as Zelensky's words being taken out of context or parsed incorrectly, what many Americans are hearing is exactly what I stated. Zelensky was trying to make a point, I agree. But after that soundbite, many Americans are thinking, F#ck You, that's enough with your bull$hit.

1. its a well understood fact, that if Russia defeats Ukraine, then afterwards Russia will move onto the next "target" in my opinion they would target the Republic of Moldova, and if successful move on to the next stage, and at some point Putler would be bold enough to target a NATO country.

2. At this point in time, there are no US soldiers fighting a war in Europe, if the S**t hits the fan, then European (bar Hungary) and American Forces will be in combat together.

3. and who says Europe wont fund it if he gets hot??

 

[Chazman]

Having failed to make any dent in unity earlier with their rather pathetic propaganda, it's rather sad to see that Russia's latest efforts to cast Ukraine's efforts to obtain the tools to do the job as "scrounging", or "wanting your children to fight for them" getting some traction.

It's interesting that any varied view or any criticism of Zelensky is automatically labelled pro-Russian propaganda. In fact, it really isn't.

 

[Chazman]

1. its a well understood fact, that if Russia defeats Ukraine, then afterwards Russia will move onto the next "target" in my opinion they would target the Republic of Moldova, and if successful move on to the next stage, and at some point Putler would be bold enough to target a NATO country.

2. At this point in time, there are no US soldiers fighting a war in Europe, if the S**t hits the fan, then European (bar Hungary) and American Forces will be in combat together.

3. and who says Europe wont fund it if he gets hot??

1) Understood by who? Russia is in no shape to do anything other than freefall into a spiral of economic disaster and demographic catastrophe. Who would they "target" and how would they win? They can barely handle their current situation.

2) There are US troops in Ukraine now, doing "training" or whatever else. If the $h!t hits the fan, we know who will be doing the fighting.

3) LOL!!!!!! Hahaha! You are joking with me, right?

 

[Connaught Ranger]

1) Understood by who? Russia is in no shape to do anything other than freefall into a spiral of economic disaster and demographic catastrophe. Who would they "target" and how would they win? They can barely handle their current situation.

2) There are US troops in Ukraine now, doing "training" or whatever else. If the $h!t hits the fan, we know who will be doing the fighting.

3) LOL!!!!!! Hahaha! You are joking with me, right?

1. Russia and its military are not quite a spent/defeated force as of yet, and it has yet to be seen if China decide to help them.

2. I would like to see some concrete proof that there are US Military personnel deployed in Ukraine have you got any?

3. You "reply" to my 3rd point was not really an answer was it.

 

[Connaught Ranger]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[TheKiwi]

It's interesting that any varied view or any criticism of Zelensky is automatically labelled pro-Russian propaganda. In fact, it really isn't.

No but there is currently a certain narrative that is being pushed that is definitely being driven by Russian propaganda. It's not even subtle (as if Russian propaganda ever would be).

 

[Chazman]

1. Russia and its military are not quite a spent/defeated force as of yet, and it has yet to be seen if China decide to help them.

2. I would like to see some concrete proof that there are US Military personnel deployed in Ukraine have you got any?

3. You "reply" to my 3rd point was not really an answer was it.

1) They still have bodies and machines, but their best 200,000 troops and 10,000 armored vehicles are gone. Take on NATO? Please!

2) The Biden administration had said so more than once. For "non-combat" purposes.

3) I was trying to be nice. Nope, Europe won't fund WWIII....nor will some countries even try to defend themselves.

 

[Chazman]

No but there is currently a certain narrative that is being pushed that is definitely being driven by Russian propaganda. It's not even subtle (as if Russian propaganda ever would be).

Oh, I am certainly not denying Russian propaganda and bots. But on the other side of that equation, any reasonable discussion which deviates from the mind hive is fingered as Russian propaganda. It will be interesting to see what Zelensky is like post war. He has already outlawed other political parties, the church and taken control of all media. We'll see if questioning that at that point will also be called pro-Russian propaganda.

 

[Jake84]

3) I was trying to be nice. Nope, Europe won't fund WWIII....nor will some countries even try to defend themselves.

Can you elaborate on this one?

 

[TheKiwi]

Oh, I am certainly not denying Russian propaganda and bots. But on the other side of that equation, any reasonable discussion which deviates from the mind hive is fingered as Russian propaganda. It will be interesting to see what Zelensky is like post war. He has already outlawed other political parties, the church and taken control of all media. We'll see if questioning that at that point will also be called pro-Russian propaganda.

But it's not really that simple is it. Much like the UK and USA banned Nazi party's during WW2, so Ukraine has outlawed those with direct links to Putin. Those parties that don't claim and overwhelming desire for submission to Moscow haven't been banned. Likewise the Ukrainian Orthodox Church continues, but those that preached submission to the Patriarch of Moscow (a former KGB agent) have been closed.

These are all pretty normal behaviours for a nation at war. Post war, then yes we shall see. And if things stay the same then you would be quite justified to use my ex-wife's four favourite words - "I told you so".

 

[shonima]

Oh, I am certainly not denying Russian propaganda and bots. But on the other side of that equation, any reasonable discussion which deviates from the mind hive is fingered as Russian propaganda. It will be interesting to see what Zelensky is like post war. He has already outlawed other political parties, the church and taken control of all media. We'll see if questioning that at that point will also be called pro-Russian propaganda.

They(Ukraine) are in a middle of a war. They don’t have a luxury of playing it democratic way. If Zelensky will become dictator, we know how Ukrainians are good at overthrowing dictators + Ukraine will be rebuilt with Western help, which he won’t get if he will fail as a leader. Yes, they do have issues with corruption and billionaires, but they will handle it, they’ve already showed a good progress. Most important now is a survival and winning, everything else is solvable

 

[Chazman]

Can you elaborate on this one?

I'd be happy to.

Willingness to fight for one's own country and attitudes towards safety and war - Win Worldwide Independent Network of Market Research and Opinion Poll

WIN International, the world’s leading association in market research and polling has published a recent survey exploring the views and beliefs of 19,422 individuals among citizens from 24 countries across the globe about war and attitudes towards it. Self-perception and connection to the...

winmr.com

If we go off this poll, it looks like Germany would be the first to surrender, followed closely by Spain and Italy.

 

[Chazman]

But it's not really that simple is it. Much like the UK and USA banned Nazi party's during WW2, so Ukraine has outlawed those with direct links to Putin. Those parties that don't claim and overwhelming desire for submission to Moscow haven't been banned. Likewise the Ukrainian Orthodox Church continues, but those that preached submission to the Patriarch of Moscow (a former KGB agent) have been closed.

These are all pretty normal behaviours for a nation at war. Post war, then yes we shall see. And if things stay the same then you would be quite justified to use my ex-wife's four favourite words - "I told you so".

I get it. I'm just saying that once power is seized, it isn't relinquished easily.

 

[Jake84]

I'd be happy to.

Willingness to fight for one's own country and attitudes towards safety and war - Win Worldwide Independent Network of Market Research and Opinion Poll

WIN International, the world’s leading association in market research and polling has published a recent survey exploring the views and beliefs of 19,422 individuals among citizens from 24 countries across the globe about war and attitudes towards it. Self-perception and connection to the...

winmr.com

View attachment 424801

Okay dude. Based on some random dingus on the streets that have been asked whether or not they were going to fight for their own country.

Do you also have a map for Biden’s USA in case shyte gets real? That could be interesting as well.

In short: I was expecting some facts making you come up with this claim, not some random worthless maps, but if that’s the only thing you can contribute then more power to you.