Warfare Russia/Ukraine War

[PEMM]

Frankly, I don't see how. Trump's made it abundantly clear he blames Zelensky for the war and deems him a dictator playing with fire. If Trump really means what he said last night, he'll have to try and sabotage any effort by another country to fill Uncle Sam's shoes.

By doing what rheinmetal did by turning it's automotive factories for defense equipment. We must partially turn on the war economy and take the economic hit from that for few years until Ukraine is in realistic position for peace. Normal procedures are too slow.

 

[Connaught Ranger]

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[NebrHogger]

I checked with Ukrainian friends about yesterday's sh1t show. They're still saying Z isn't nearly as popular there as he wants the world to believe. They also sent a Ukrainian meme relating to Z's departure from the WH. Make of it what you will.

 

[Connaught Ranger]

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[nemipuka_]

"Why don't you wear a suit?"

 

[Mike1976]

And the world can thank Zekensky for the second time, firstly for standing up to the Russians, and secondly because from now on all European and non-European leaders could see what you can expect from the US under the heading of "Resolute diplomacy".

Explicit warnings signs have come for 17+ years and nothing was done beyond blaming political opponents for the state of affairs. Nothing meaningful will change because the willigness isn't there.

By doing what rheinmetal did by turning it's automotive factories for defense equipment. We must partially turn on the war economy and take the economic hit from that for few years until Ukraine is in realistic position for peace. Normal procedures are too slow.

Won't happen, but yes.

 

[Junglejim]

China's time to act might be running out. If China offers to help rebuild Ukraine and be a peacekeeper/buffer between the two warring nations... it would be a masterstroke. they would need to do this before the EU starts acting like a super power and unite and while Ukraine is desperate. China right now has the clout to pull Russia in line and the same time be a guarantor for Ukraine.

 

[Mike1976]

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[Chazman]

Frankly, I don't see how. Trump's made it abundantly clear he blames Zelensky for the war and deems him a dictator playing with fire. If Trump really means what he said last night, he'll have to try and sabotage any effort by another country to fill Uncle Sam's shoes.

Quite honestly, I'm now of the opinion this whole charade was a set-up to find an excuse to cut Ukraine off. The animosity was unprecedented, including by the hand-picked journalists.

For example, what the hell was that question by MTG's boyfriend about Zelensky "disrespecting" America because he didn't wear a suit to the meet? Zelensky hasn't worn a suit in three years, it's a sign of solidarity with the troops on the front, and every casual observer should know as much.

Look … The economy. Domestic security. I'll give you those, Trump's doing some good things in those fields.

But as a crisis manager, as a diplomat, as the so called leader of the free world, he's dangerously inept. And Bolton was absolutely right to point that out. What happened last night wasn't "transactional diplomacy". Trump cearly expected a cowtow from Zelensky, and when he didn't get it he threw a fit over a perceived slight. In doing so, he signalled to the world that whenever he talks about a "good deal for America", all he really wants is to have his ego stroked.

I do agree about the suit question. Z could have handled it better though, to be honest. But whatever.

If the problem with the minerals agreement was "security", that should have already been discussed previously in private. Doing it in public, in front of the press pool, in the Oval Office, minutes before signing, was just unheard of.

Here are the facts on the ground. Trump throws Z out of the White House, without his lunch and the agreement unsigned. European "leaders" send Z tender tweets but empty gift envelopes. Trump at a Q and A afterwards says he wants peace immediately, he doesn't want the Mineral Agreement and then get dragged into a war over it.

So there we have it.

 

[PEMM]

Won't happen, but yes.

Exactly, it's the problem of will, not capability.

We should have something like that white feather campaign during the great War. But instead of feathers, we hand out cardboard cuts of testicles for EU leaders. They can tape those on before meetings, like tomorrow.

 

[surfpunk]

I checked with Ukrainian friends about yesterday's sh1t show. They're still saying Z isn't nearly as popular there as he wants the world to believe. They also sent a Ukrainian meme relating to Z's departure from the WH. Make of it what you will.
View attachment 520476

are your friends still in Ukraine? have they been in active combat or do they have any skin in that game in some fashion? what exactly do they want to happen, since they dont like zelensky? what course of action do they want to see occur?

 

[surfpunk]

I do agree about the suit question. Z could have handled it better though, to be honest. But whatever.

If the problem with the minerals agreement was "security", that should have already been discussed previously in private. Doing it in public, in front of the press pool, in the Oval Office, minutes before signing, was just unheard of.

Here are the facts on the ground. Trump throws Z out of the White House, without his lunch and the agreement unsigned. European "leaders" send Z tender tweets but empty gift envelopes. Trump at a Q and A afterwards says he wants peace immediately, he doesn't want the Mineral Agreement and then get dragged into a war over it.

So there we have it.

why should he be in a suit? trump looks like he slept in his. how is wearing a baseball hat any different? maybe zelensky is trying to show some kind of solidarity with his fellow Ukrainians through his image in some way. he is a wartime leader, under duress.
in any case it is irrelevant. the only question should be not if russia is curb stomped but by how much.

 

[Chazman]

why should he be in a suit? trump looks like he slept in his. how is wearing a baseball hat any different? maybe zelensky is trying to show some kind of solidarity with his fellow Ukrainians through his image in some way. he is a wartime leader, under duress.
in any case it is irrelevant. the only question should be not if russia is curb stomped but by how much.

Personally, I don't care. We know it's his schtick.

 

[surfpunk]

I do agree about the suit question. Z could have handled it better though, to be honest. But whatever.

If the problem with the minerals agreement was "security", that should have already been discussed previously in private. Doing it in public, in front of the press pool, in the Oval Office, minutes before signing, was just unheard of.

Here are the facts on the ground. Trump throws Z out of the White House, without his lunch and the agreement unsigned. European "leaders" send Z tender tweets but empty gift envelopes. Trump at a Q and A afterwards says he wants peace immediately, he doesn't want the Mineral Agreement and then get dragged into a war over it.

So there we have it.

the onus should be on RUSSIA to stop the war, not Ukraine. trump should be kicking putin to the curb, not zelensky. I voted for trump 3 times and I am not happy about this, I had hoped with people like vance and hedgspeth that they would sympathize with ukraine and be able to show trump that it is 100 percent russia that is at fault and needs to be dealt with. I was also hoping rubio had grown some testicles but apparently he has not.

 

[Chazman]

the onus should be on RUSSIA to stop the war, not Ukraine. trump should be kicking putin to the curb, not zelensky. I voted for trump 3 times and I am not happy about this, I had hoped with people like vance and hedgspeth that they would sympathize with ukraine and be able to show trump that it is 100 percent russia that is at fault and needs to be dealt with. I was also hoping rubio had grown some testicles but apparently he has not.

What do you think should have happened? It was basically a nice 48 minute press conference which went off the rails in the last 7 minutes. Z calls out JD on his "diplomacy" comment and it all went south from there. I've never seen anything like that.

 

[Telmar]

I think it's also time to reduce weapon dependency to the USA.

It can be a great opportunity for european aircraft and engine manufacturers

 

[Telmar]

the onus should be on RUSSIA to stop the war, not Ukraine. trump should be kicking putin to the curb, not zelensky. I voted for trump 3 times and I am not happy about this, I had hoped with people like vance and hedgspeth that they would sympathize with ukraine and be able to show trump that it is 100 percent russia that is at fault and needs to be dealt with. I was also hoping rubio had grown some testicles but apparently he has not.

I think there are personal antagonisms between the two that flared up during the "quid pro quo" hearings in the midst of Trumps´s first mandate.

And Zelensky was closer to Biden than he was to Republicans...which is understandabe when at Trump gatherings in summer 2024 they called him a "gay weirdo". (Ted Nugent).

 

[Mike1976]

I think it's also time to reduce weapon dependency to the USA.

It can be a great opportunity for european aircraft and engine manufacturers

There's no other way than in the interim (and I say "interim" although I don't believe there'll be any further action beyond that) buying weapons for our own armed forces from none-alligned nations that do have the manufacturing capability like South-Korea, Brazil or Israel.

But well muh genocide, muh national industry, muh green deal etc etc etc bla bla bla.

 

[NebrHogger]

are your friends still in Ukraine? have they been in active combat or do they have any skin in that game in some fashion? what exactly do they want to happen, since they dont like zelensky? what course of action do they want to see occur?

My main Ukrainian friend (married to a very close friend) lives in Belgium now. Her parents, whom I've met in person and have held conversations with still live in Kyiv. My friend has a brother and cousins actually fighting in the war. All ardently want the killing and destruction to stop. Keep in mind this is from only one family and may not represent all Ukrainians.

 

[Telmar]

There's no other way than in the interim (and I say "interim" although I don't believe there'll be any further action beyond that) buying weapons for our own armed forces from none-alligned nations that do have the manufacturing capability like South-Korea, Brazil or Israel.

But well muh genocide, muh national industry, muh green deal etc etc etc bla bla bla.

There is stuff and stuff.

We have let I believe too many european companies pull us to putting all our money into expensive weapons which high tech will compensate for bonzai quantities. Traditional manufacturing of sheels, parts explosives, and drones might be in foreign countries.

I am no military specialist, but my feeling is that also if Ukraine had had a stronger airforce, the Russians would not have benn able to take all the land they took: by bombing the conflict area, and bombing critical transport infrastructure in Russia. For that we have in Europe good manufacturers with Dassault on the high end (also financially) with the Rafale but great planes such as the Typhoon or the Gripen.

Something that I read but seems debunked was that the USA refused a Gripen sale to the Colombian air force because it has an American engine. This is not acceptable.