Photos Polish Armed Forces

[Conhoon]

The Bayraktar TB2 unmanned aerial vehicle is a medium-range tactical machine with the ability to carry weapons, so it fits into the assumptions of the Polish "Gryf" program.

Bayraktar TB2 has a maximum take-off weight of 650 kg and a wingspan of 12 meters. An operating ceiling of up to 6,750 meters and an operating range of 150 km from the control post ensure a wide range of operational use. The cruising speed is 130 km / h and the maximum speed is over 220 km / h. The drive is a single 100 HP Rotax 912 piston engine with a push propeller.
They are armed with 37.5 kg UMTAS anti-tank guided missiles, 22.5 kg MAM-L light circulating ammunition, and probably also 70 mm Cirit missiles. So far, Bayraktary has been ordered by: Libya, Azerbaijan, Qatar, Morocco and Ukraine. They were used in combat in Nagorno-Karabakh, Syria and Libya.

According to the available information, Polish project "Gryf" envisages the purchase of a total of 15 sets, so - perhaps - currently purchased Turkish drones (4 sets, i.e.24 aircrafts) are treated only as a purchase to achieve the initial capability.

 

[Musashi]

The Bayraktar TB2 unmanned aerial vehicle is a medium-range tactical machine with the ability to carry weapons, so it fits into the assumptions of the Polish "Gryf" program.

No, it fits partially. According to the Gryf programme, we were to purchase drones with a primary scouting capability and a secondary attack capability. It's the way around in case of the Bayraktar TB2.
Anyway, the Bayraktar is a cool drone, so the decision is correct. First of all, it's very cheap, so we can buy much more drones for the alloted amount of money. Secondly, losing a Bayraktar would be much less painful and costly comparing to, let's say, losing a Reaper.

In general, the Polish government declared that Poland is going to start cooperating extensively in the defence industry with the Turks.
Some people say the reason may have been that the Biden administration discontinued Trump's policy of taking a sh!t on the North Stream 2, so the Polish government got upset and decided to show the Americans the finger and stopped buying a U.S. military hardware that can be replaced by an alternative hardware. If it's true, I also support it.

The next news is, a group of Turkish F16s, participating in the Baltic Air Policing mission, will be deployed in the Polish airbase in Malbork rather than in Siaulai (Lithuania) or Aamari (Estonia).

 

[Conhoon]

No, it fits partially. According to the Gryf programme, we were to purchase drones with a primary scouting capability and a secondary attack capability. It's the way around in case of the Bayraktar TB2.
Anyway, the Bayraktar is a cool drone, so the decision is correct. First of all, it's very cheap, so we can buy much more drones for the alloted amount of money. Secondly, losing a Bayraktar would be much less painful and costly comparing to, let's say, losing a Reaper.

In general, the Polish government declared that Poland is going to start cooperating extensively in the defence industry with the Turks.
Some people say the reason may have been that the Biden administration discontinued Trump's policy of taking a sh!t on the North Stream 2, so the Polish government got upset and decided to show the Americans the finger and stopped buying a U.S. military hardware that can be replaced by an alternative hardware. If it's true, I also support it.

The next news is, a group of Turkish F16s, participating in the Baltic Air Policing mission, will be deployed in the Polish airbase in Malbork rather than in Siaulai (Lithuania) or Aamari (Estonia).

You're right, @Musashi. The Polish government sent a clear signal that Poland will start extensive cooperation with the Turks in the arms industry - and I think it's good, diversification of suppliers will be useful. The location of the Turkish fighters may be a gesture from the Turkish side at the beginning of cooperation.

 

[BravoZulu]

ORP Gen K Pulaski departing the Clyde this morning.

@DougieCoullPics

 

[CemalPasha]

Turkish military delegation's visit to Poland in the mid 1920s. The head of the delegation was General Naci Eldeniz. Photo's from
Łukasz Fyderek & Necmettin Özçelik

in 1936, Turkish MOD ordered 40 P.24 fighter aircraft produced by Polish state owned PZL aircraft factory.

Besides those 40 fighters, Turkey produced 20 more planes under license. They were built in TOMTAS factory in Kayseri (centeral Turkey). This were the first fighters produced/assembled in Turkey. P.24 was a quite a successful design, with a top speed of 410 km/h, two 20mm cannons and two 7,9mm guns.

After WWII broke out, a number of Polish aviation engineers escaped the Nazi and Soviet occupation and moved to Britain. During the Battle of Britain, Polish and Turkish officials agreed on sending a group of aviation engineers to Turkey. In May 1941 the group reached Ankara and helped to create THK Aircraft Factory - (Türk Hava Kurumu Ucak Fabrikasi). Their first design was THK 1 Transport glider. A single prototype was made. The glider had 26 m wingspan, 12.6 m length and was capable of carrying 10 soldiers with 2 crew and equipment.

The next one was THK 2 aerobatic trainer aircraft. It was a streamlined low-wing monoplane with an elliptic wing. The plane had good flying characteristics and entered the service as an advanced trainer in Turkish Air Force.

Their other design was THK 5 twin-engine light passenger aircraft, renamed as MKEK-5. It was a low-wing cantilever monoplane of wooden construction. Interestingly it was also the first Turkish airplane exported abroad: One plane in air ambulance configuration was sold to Denmark.

Finally, THK 11 was constructed. It was a cantilever monoplane with twin boom and a pusher propeller configuration. An unorthodox deign, was intended as a touring plane. Some decades later, the same aerodynamic configuration will become a standard one for drones, including TB2.

THK 11 was the last design of the Polish engineers’ team in Turkey, the group left the country in 1946, and the factory was later taken over by the Turkish state-owned corporation MKEK. Between 1941 and 1946, the factory was managed by Jerzy Wędrychowski and Selahattin Beler.

Polish engineers: Stanisław Rogalski, Leszek Dulęba, Józef Dziewoński, Józef Lekszycki, Jerzy Lewczuk, and Jerzy Teisseyre, before 1939 worked together in the RWD aviation works, renowned for their RWD-6 and RWD-9 planes, winners of the Challenge International de Tourisme. In Turkey, besides their work in THK, Polish engineers lectured at the Istanbul Technical University. The story is little known, but an interesting case of a knowledge transfer in the aviation industry.

Even in the eighties, there was an airplane construction partnership. Bayraktar was not a surprise

 

[NoOne]

Politics makes strange bedfellows and it's hard to argue that the Bayraktar doesn't fill a critical requirement quickly and cost effectively.

I wonder how the détente between Moscow and Ankara is faring these days?

 

[Conhoon]

Joint operation of the ships of the Polish Navy and the Standing Group of the NATO Mine Defense Forces Group 1 at the Baltic Sea, May 2021.

One of the ships of the Polish navy participating in the operation is the tanker ORP Bałtyk from the 3rd Ship Flotilla. Its crew, among other things, will be supplying other ships at sea (RAS - Replenishment at sea).
The photos show this ship's passage to the operation area.

 

[Conhoon]

Politics makes strange bedfellows and it's hard to argue that the Bayraktar doesn't fill a critical requirement quickly and cost effectively.

I wonder how the détente between Moscow and Ankara is faring these days?

I do not know what it looks like in the military space, but as long as Poland is not able to independently build communication systems for the most important equipment, along with software codes, it must always take into account that the data will "leak" to a potential enemy (and it does not matter whether it is Russia or someone else).

 

[NoOne]

I do not know what it looks like in the military space, but as long as Poland is not able to independently build communication systems for the most important equipment, along with software codes, it must always take into account that the data will "leak" to a potential enemy (and it does not matter whether it is Russia or someone else).

So true.

 

[Faheka]

Politics makes strange bedfellows and it's hard to argue that the Bayraktar doesn't fill a critical requirement quickly and cost effectively.

I wonder how the détente between Moscow and Ankara is faring these days?

Actually, you made a good point. We have never been friends with Russia. We are a NATO state bordering on the Soviet Union since the cold war era. We are the only state in the Caucasus, Libya, Syria and Crimea that really bothered them. It is a great power that we have to get along with because we have borders. The S400 incident is the result of the coup attempt I witnessed live on 15 July 2015. The person responsible for this still lives in the USA. As if the chamber was not enough, weapons, money and political support were provided to the terrorist organization that killed 40,000 people. If I just blame the USA, the room would be wrong. There are also mistakes made by our current government.

 

[Conhoon]

Actually, you made a good point. We have never been friends with Russia. We are a NATO state bordering on the Soviet Union since the cold war era. We are the only state in the Caucasus, Libya, Syria and Crimea that really bothered them. It is a great power that we have to get along with because we have borders. The S400 incident is the result of the coup attempt I witnessed live on 15 July 2015. The person responsible for this still lives in the USA. As if the chamber was not enough, weapons, money and political support were provided to the terrorist organization that killed 40,000 people. If I just blame the USA, the room would be wrong. There are also mistakes made by our current government.

We have a similar situation. We are in such a place in the world (and Turkey and Poland) that we will always be balancing between the superpowers, because where we are, the roads of the East and the West converge. Politics will always be difficult here.

But let's leave politics behind, let's go back to the topic of drones. During the Nagorno-Karabakh war, on the one hand, Turkish drones proved to be very effective, on the other, the Russian side had the opportunity (and probably used this opportunity) to learn about the radio-electronic characteristics of Bayraktar. I wonder if, with possible subsequent orders, it will be possible to place some communication elements in plants in Poland?

 

[BravoZulu]

18 Mechanised Division Ex Dragon21

 

[Conhoon]

18 Mechanised Division Ex Dragon21
View attachment 309919View attachment 309920View attachment 309921View attachment 309922

My God - where did they find those camouflage nets? Leopard 2PL from last year's delivery with camouflage net from 1950/1960 ...

 

[NoOne]

We have a similar situation. We are in such a place in the world (and Turkey and Poland) that we will always be balancing between the superpowers, because where we are, the roads of the East and the West converge. Politics will always be difficult here.
View attachment 309788
But let's leave politics behind, let's go back to the topic of drones. During the Nagorno-Karabakh war, on the one hand, Turkish drones proved to be very effective, on the other, the Russian side had the opportunity (and probably used this opportunity) to learn about the radio-electronic characteristics of Bayraktar. I wonder if, with possible subsequent orders, it will be possible to place some communication elements in plants in Poland?

View attachment 309789

...and how amenable will the Turks be to broader technology transfers and licensing?

 

[Faheka]

We have a similar situation. We are in such a place in the world (and Turkey and Poland) that we will always be balancing between the superpowers, because where we are, the roads of the East and the West converge. Politics will always be difficult here.
View attachment 309788
But let's leave politics behind, let's go back to the topic of drones. During the Nagorno-Karabakh war, on the one hand, Turkish drones proved to be very effective, on the other, the Russian side had the opportunity (and probably used this opportunity) to learn about the radio-electronic characteristics of Bayraktar. I wonder if, with possible subsequent orders, it will be possible to place some communication elements in plants in Poland?

View attachment 309789

We are a country that suffers from technology transfer. We can be the best country that understands your situation. I think we sold ANKA's that we sold to Tunisia with technology transfer, I am sure they will help with anything the Polish army may want.

 

[Conhoon]

...and how amenable will the Turks be to broader technology transfers and licensing?

It depends on the effectiveness of the negotiations. Polish companies also have several products that Turkey may find useful. In fact, both Poland and Turkey can benefit from cooperation.

 

[Conhoon]

ORP "Kormoran" in Joint operation of the ships of the Polish Navy and the Standing NATO Mine Countermeasures Group 1 at the Baltic Sea, May 2021.

 

[Conhoon]

5th Battalion, 21st Podhale Rifles Brigade, Nowa Dęba training area, Poland, May 2021

 

[Conhoon]

Special Operations Division of the Military Gendarmerie, Baltic Sea, May 2021

 

[Conhoon]

Special Operations Division of the Military Gendarmerie, Baltic Sea, May 2021