Politics Warren Admits Universal Medicare will result in 2 million job losses

[muck]

That'd be good for the average American indeed. If there was a fixed list of terms of conditions, they could vote with their feet against excessive charges.

 

[bfc1001]

Trump's nailed it . After all this time , it was the doctors and nurses fault for charging too much . I did happen to see some of the press conference and some of the talking heads spoke of a " revolution of a lifetime " with trump in agreement . I just hope that in rural America " customers" have the choice of more than 1 doctor .

 

[primer]

I guess that's a problem. Cowboys Daughter said many rural medical centers closed. Remote health care is problematic in most countries.

 

[muck]

Trump's nailed it . After all this time , it was the doctors and nurses fault for charging too much . I did happen to see some of the press conference and some of the talking heads spoke of a " revolution of a lifetime " with trump in agreement . I just hope that in rural America " customers" have the choice of more than 1 doctor .

It's not the doctors' and nurses' fault though, is it. Hospitals are run by managers, not doctors. What's surprising to me is the health insurance sector seems not to mind the lack of transparency. Shouldn't the individual providers be interested in not being charged more than their rivals?

 

[primer]

Some of these "managers" are on multi million $ salaries in the US. I guess these hospitals are big but my cousins in charge of NZ biggest intensive care and star ship here careers still have to strike for fair pay increase.

Really in the last 30 years the corporate salaries have continued a gradual stratospheric rise, their earnings are public and they aren't shy about it.

 

[bfc1001]

It's not the doctors' and nurses' fault though, is it. Hospitals are run by managers, not doctors. What's surprising to me is the health insurance sector seems not to mind the lack of transparency. Shouldn't the individual providers be interested in not being charged more than their rivals?

To be honest muck I was being sarcastic ........ Until I looked up US doctors pay .

The problem of doctors’ salaries

Why doctors get paid too much and what we should do about it.

www.politico.com

It appears their on more than twice as much than the rest of the developed world . But yes your right , it's not just the doctors fault . It's the whole system , top to bottom . Until trump addresses not only staff pay , but insurance premiums and med prices I'll see this move as nothing more than a red herring .

 

[primer]

Clearly the main part of a market is the customer knowing the price.

US patents by making continuation application they can hold onto a monoply for another 20 years and potentially so on.

 

[Euroamerican]

Customers knowing the pricing, or taking time to get educated beforehand, is a big part of the problem... me thinks. Most people don't like to think ahead of time about medical bills that could occur. Even with insurance, the copayment a and non-covered costs (procedures/medicines/labor) are sometimes a lot higher than the customer is ready for.

On top of that, you've got differential pricing for the same procedure. Differential, as in, different price for the same procedure depending on whether or not you have insurance!

 

[Ivan le Fou]

White House unveils rules requiring online disclosure of hospital prices

The Trump administration on Friday unveiled new rules to require increased disclosure of health care prices, in a move officials said would drive down costs by increasing competition. One regu…

thehill.com

 

[primer]

Thanks to pharmaceutical patent gaps.. even Chinese patients go to India for generic drugs, Americans go to cheap Mexican generic drugs and these places supply from UK to NZ cheaper drugs . There is alot to be said for and against patent protection. Those drugs wouldn't have been invented without the plain fact of the matter, the company makes money and the US patients funds most of it. Can't complain quite so loudly that the US system is expensive after considering that. Currently they are effectively subsidizing millions of noncontributing patients of the world.
There is price gouging in the US, that recent case where the owner of the drug pumped the price from $13 a pill to $750 then went to prison not for gouging but securities fraud. Indicating that pure monopoly does needs control. What if everyone paid. A world based patent system for pharmaceuticals thus spreading cost and risk.

 

[Mordoror]

and the US patients funds most of it.

As a former insider of Big Pharma i can tell you that patient contributes almost none to R&D because R&D is the least of the department getting the funds.
Most are going in marketing, HR and shares
Yes a drug is expensive to obtain but Big Pharma don't focus anymore on R&D but on capitalist growth. Patents are bought cheaply from start ups and univ labs discoveries. That's also why drug pipelines are getting emptier .....

 

[primer]

Yes the private researchers and universities are always in the news with early breakthrough discovery and then its many years until its passed the full testing. Its all expensive though, the entire ecosystem. An given sizeable law suits costs handed down, not for the faint hearted.
These are not dime a dozen researchers working like humanitarian Albert Schweitzer .

So apparently its a large part gouging? Generally what portion of the of price is that?

We have some shares in F&P healthcare NZ company that is 10x in the last 7 years based on their patents and R&D. Up until recently it was all hard graft.

 

[Mordoror]

[QUOTE="primer, post: 65048, member: ].

So apparently its a large part gouging? Generally what portion of the of price is that?

[/QUOTE]
It s hard to answer you precisely. Simply put if you check the news a lot of big pharma are closing R&D dep (sanofi, pfizer, merck-msd) while their shares are going up and their marketing deps are bloating.
This is not a sane move.
Furthermore when you know that these big pharma are taking bank loans (because low interests ) to increase share dividends distribution.
You have another factor, they are borderline creating consortiums, not on prices but on the drug distribution.
I have seen first hand big pharma x giving away the patent for an anticancer drug (because it had too much of that kind of drigs in its files);to big pharma y in exchange of a diabetis drug.
Like during a card game.

 

[Flagg]

[QUOTE="primer, post: 65048, member: ].

So apparently its a large part gouging? Generally what portion of the of price is that?

It s hard to answer you precisely. Simply put if you check the news a lot of big pharma are closing R&D dep (sanofi, pfizer, merck-msd) while their shares are going up and their marketing deps are bloating.
This is not a sane move.
Furthermore when you know that these big pharma are taking bank loans (because low interests ) to increase share dividends distribution.
You have another factor, they are borderline creating consortiums, not on prices but on the drug distribution.
I have seen first hand big pharma x giving away the patent for an anticancer drug (because it had too much of that kind of drigs in its files);to big pharma y in exchange of a diabetis drug.
Like during a card game.
[/QUOTE]

I suspect the silliness with big pharm also had to do with the need to shift business models towards a likely future of personal precision medicine.

Retail price on genome sequencing fell to $199 last year(temporarily for holidays).

We are less than 5 years away from full genome sequencing dropping to the price of a pizza, although professional human advice beyond AI med chatbot will still cost heaps.

My family had been sequenced. My family doctor thinks I’m a nerd because he couldn’t do anything with it. Then the clear, concise, data driven genetic insights started arriving as comparable user datasets grow.

In 10 years we will have 10 million humans sequenced and some real health and wellness wins.

in 20 years we will have billions of humans sequenced and virtually unlimited human health, wellness, fitness, and longevity wisdom from mining those big data sets.

If I had to guess, genetic/genomics is going to the moon within 10 years, while big pharm will(as you alluded to) start acting more like private equity/venture capital for healthcare with their cash stockpiles.

Physics(genetics/genomics) versus chemistry(big pharm)

One-off gene therapies versus one sized fits all chemical compounds.

How much will people pay for a better last 5 years? 10 years?

How much will people pay for an extra 5 years? 10 years?

The answer is everything.

And that adds up to trillions In profit.

Proletariat baying for the blood of 1%ers is nothing now.

Give it another 10 years, and a max of 20 years.

Those who are paying attention are already seeing differentials in income based life expectancies(100 years ago there was practically zero differential between the wealthy and working class).