Politics NZ anniversary: Country divided over Cook’s landing

[primer]

Tens of millions of dollars going to Treaty of Waitangi negotiators and lawyers

So roughly 6 mill per year since first settlement 1998 with Tainui. 120 million actually sounds believable for lawyers and gravy trains which is a substantial amount. These deals have been going on prior of course and ther have been several settlements in decades prior, throughout the 20th century only to require "top ups".

They have engineered a revolving legal sytem that is not available for any other NZer

 

[NZM305]

Tens of millions of dollars going to Treaty of Waitangi negotiators and lawyers

So roughly 6 mill per year since first settlement 1998 with Tainui. 120 million actually sounds believable for lawyers and gravy trains which is a substantial amount. These deals have been going on prior of course and ther have been several settlements in decades prior, throughout the 20th century only to require "top ups".

They have engineered a revolving legal sytem that is not available for any other NZer

Those figures you've quoted appear to be the money the crown has spent on its own side of the negotiations, and dont appear to show any money that has or hasn't been given to iwi to help do the necessary research for the claims.

And your right the crown has engineered this system to suit there own purposes.

 

[gafkiwi]

They're all as bad as each other. The Govt and hangers on milking the process with bureaucracy and the tribes chucking each other under the bus as well as rampant in fighting among themselves. Its just as disgusting seeing the "Tribal Elders" who sit on the trust boards living up large when a lot of their wider tribe live below the poverty line with little Waitangi coin making it to that level. Its not very visible the amount of bad blood between the tribes from various things in distant/recent history.

 

[NZM305]

Here's a series from the Iwi Negotiators point of view if any one is interested, (yes you have to join but no credit card or anything).
https://www.maoritelevision.com/sho...q7yCvlawQ0ZAtBLxmDhNyFtzUuTJooY11rWQHSlYKXlEY

 

[Mordoror]

Would agree with every responses so far, it’s human nature innit? Then the British were ruling the world and pretty much owned large chunk of our planet and wanted to explore more. As did the French, Spaniards, Portuguese to an extent too.

We literally built empires around the globe, of course it hasn’t been pretty and slaves were employed, killings and pillaging occurred, and so forth.

But now, to depict Maori, or the US natives, whoever else as poor victims is going a tad too far. I have empathy, but if these people have had the manpower and war machines we had then, and if Europe had been still Neanderthals with sticks, I doubt our fate would have been so much better.

Empathy and being compassionate I can agree with, just not claiming « poor man » 250 years later.

All things don't belong to the same bag
Some tribes were not expansionists (and they were usualy the first to fall either to their neighbour or european colonialist powers)
As pointed out by Kiwi we (as in European powers) have a deal of responsabilities in some cases by breaching (regularly) a bunch of treaties with various clans/tribes or even states (like kingdoms)
Social darwinism and ethnoracialism made the things justified back then and when we look back we behaved like arseholes even by today standards.
I mean a treaty is still a treaty and breaching it is still a shitty move. It could be a good legal justification to slap us back from a legal pov.

Now there is jam and butter in the history and the case of the Maori, Zulus, Araucans, Iroquis confederation and any war liking and imperialist tribes is nowhere the same when compared with Sans/bushmen, Hopis/Navajos, Morioris that were pretty much peaceful and were simply smashed and almost genocided with ease.
In one case they waged wars and lost, in the other they were simply hunted down....

 

[primer]

Maori were very good farmers and readily adapted to new ideas. They kept Auckland from starvation in its early years by delivering food by the boat load down the Waikato. Food based on European crops though. Auckland was milling Maori grain.
The Maori King movement was also a step toward ending tribal problems but also it was influenced by the concepts of the British system.
Basically the initail devlopment doesn't happen at all without stuff like horses, ploughs, saws, gold stampers. Livestock had quite the jounney. Apparently Turkeys..originally from the USA were a good thing to take on a long voyage. Stack them up in crates. very efficient on food and importantly water and hardy. Cows were carried and milked on board. Their food took up alot of expensive space.