Warfare Russia/Ukraine War
- Thread starter morris
- Start date
- Featured
Viktor Orbán: Ukraine should act as a buffer between Russia and the West
Viktor Orbán spoke to former Austrian Chancellor Wolfgang Schüssel for the UN's European Voices magazine. A long excerpt of the interview was published by Die Presse and was reviewed by hvg.hu. According to Orbán, the claim that Ukrainians are defending Europe and that their best option would be to act as a buffer between Russia and the West is not true, as Russia would never accept an EU and NATO member on its doorstep.
Russia will destroy Ukraine again and again
"Whether Ukrainians like it or not, whether Ukrainians like it or not, Ukraine is where it is on the map. Its best perspective would be to be a buffer zone between Russia and the West - with security guarantees, of course. If that fails, Ukraine will lose its land. Russia will destroy Ukraine again and again and again and again. Russia will never accept an EU and NATO member like Ukraine on its doorstep. Never," he said.
To Schüssel's suggestion that a ceasefire agreement would mean a de facto defeat for Ukraine, Orban replied that it would depend on "how we look at the future", as the Ukrainians could lose more territory and war if no agreement was reached
Orbán also disagrees that Ukraine would protect Europe because "it does not offer us Europeans any additional security, because most of us are already members of NATO, which is much stronger than Russia. There is no danger of Russia attacking a NATO member."
He said Russia would never accept Ukraine as a negotiating partner, only the United States and perhaps the European Union, "if we are smart".
"The greatest danger for Europe is if an agreement on the security structure of our continent is reached between Russia and America, over Europe's head".
To the former Austrian chancellor's suggestion that Russia could not be trusted, Orbán replied that it was not a question of trust, but of strength. "We Europeans are not strong enough for the Russians to take us seriously. It is a power game. This is a war. We have to show strength and we have to communicate clearly to the Russians: we have interests, they have interests - that is the basis on which we can make agreements.
"We are experiencing an epochal change in the world economy, one that occurs once every 500 years. The dominant position of the West is over," Orbán said. The centre of gravity of the world economy is shifting back from the West to Asia. "The core of the world economy is no longer in the transatlantic region, but in the Pacific".
full article: https://telex.hu/kulfold/2024/02/11/orban-viktor-ukrajna-oroszorszag-eu-nato-utkozozona
Viktor Orbán spoke to former Austrian Chancellor Wolfgang Schüssel for the UN's European Voices magazine. A long excerpt of the interview was published by Die Presse and was reviewed by hvg.hu. According to Orbán, the claim that Ukrainians are defending Europe and that their best option would be to act as a buffer between Russia and the West is not true, as Russia would never accept an EU and NATO member on its doorstep.
Russia will destroy Ukraine again and again
"Whether Ukrainians like it or not, whether Ukrainians like it or not, Ukraine is where it is on the map. Its best perspective would be to be a buffer zone between Russia and the West - with security guarantees, of course. If that fails, Ukraine will lose its land. Russia will destroy Ukraine again and again and again and again. Russia will never accept an EU and NATO member like Ukraine on its doorstep. Never," he said.
To Schüssel's suggestion that a ceasefire agreement would mean a de facto defeat for Ukraine, Orban replied that it would depend on "how we look at the future", as the Ukrainians could lose more territory and war if no agreement was reached
Orbán also disagrees that Ukraine would protect Europe because "it does not offer us Europeans any additional security, because most of us are already members of NATO, which is much stronger than Russia. There is no danger of Russia attacking a NATO member."
He said Russia would never accept Ukraine as a negotiating partner, only the United States and perhaps the European Union, "if we are smart".
"The greatest danger for Europe is if an agreement on the security structure of our continent is reached between Russia and America, over Europe's head".
To the former Austrian chancellor's suggestion that Russia could not be trusted, Orbán replied that it was not a question of trust, but of strength. "We Europeans are not strong enough for the Russians to take us seriously. It is a power game. This is a war. We have to show strength and we have to communicate clearly to the Russians: we have interests, they have interests - that is the basis on which we can make agreements.
"We are experiencing an epochal change in the world economy, one that occurs once every 500 years. The dominant position of the West is over," Orbán said. The centre of gravity of the world economy is shifting back from the West to Asia. "The core of the world economy is no longer in the transatlantic region, but in the Pacific".
full article: https://telex.hu/kulfold/2024/02/11/orban-viktor-ukrajna-oroszorszag-eu-nato-utkozozona
- Joined
- Feb 2, 2018
- Messages
- 8,901
- Points
- 328
If you understand Trump, those comments are aimed at Europe in general and Germany in particular. He’s always negotiating.
- Joined
- Feb 2, 2018
- Messages
- 8,901
- Points
- 328
Time to pullout your checkbook, big shot.
- Joined
- Sep 2, 2019
- Messages
- 6,437
- Points
- 378
Trump was playing to his audience, as to how tough he was, when president.
He was ,at that time he is referencing, right. Several European countries, which were well off, were paying well under the 2%.
I'd suggest NATO set a rule, that if you dont spend it yourself, it goes into the central fund, and NATO spends it. There are several poor frontline countries that could do with a few BN, which would probably be spent in the countries underspending.
.
Also I think Trump likes to appear ambiguous, as to his intent. Compared to nearly all career politicians who tell everyone including flatearthers that their view holds weight and is important, Trump doesn't do this.
And most of this is electioneering. Both USA and Europe need to help Ukr, now, to defeat Russia. Otherwise we condemn our kids/grandkids to years of war in Europe, then USA v China in 20-30 years time.
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2019
- Messages
- 7,973
- Points
- 284
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2019
- Messages
- 7,973
- Points
- 284
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2019
- Messages
- 7,973
- Points
- 284
Ah yes, I believe these are the times that MAGA refers to..
But I really don't believe people...
Trump won't because it's only an election year...
Bullshit baby. I live in a country where Orban was told, oh, he won't do it, it's just election talk.
He did it.
In a country whose neighbour was attacked by Russia, after years of warning signs, to which everyone just shrugged, "Ah Putin won't do it, it's just propagnda, election stuff."
They should pull the bloody heads out of the back of the ostrich....
don't care if he is a hero or not, and I don't care if he is in Ukraine, but it is a shame that he is one of the smallest q French aid and he is on the phone with Putin
Especially in the light of the fact that if Trump becomes president and he really is crazy, it will be the French nuclear weapons that will protect the EU.
Especially in the light of the fact that if Trump becomes president and he really is crazy, it will be the French nuclear weapons that will protect the EU.
- Joined
- Jun 18, 2019
- Messages
- 5,834
- Points
- 258
Are you serious?
Putain has never intended to attack countries like France or Germany. He intends to rebuild the USSR and it's his primary goal.
The NATO countries bordering RuZZia or Belarus are Poland, Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia.
Regarding Poland, we have been spending 2% of our GDP on defence for many years and so has Estonia. Lithuania and Latvia had been taking the piss for many years but got serious in 2022. They reintroduced the draft and increased their spending.
Poland increased its spending from 2% to 4%, the highest percentage in the NATO.
The Polish Army would have looked better not if we had not spent $10bn (it was worth much more 10-15 years ago) on the U.S.-led missions in Iraq and Afghanistan.
So, we had spent 100% of our defence budget on the U.S.-led missions between 2003 and 2022 and were given a lot of sh1t from France and Germany because of participating in the BS mission in Iraq and a lot of sh1t from them for installing the anti-ballistic shield on our territory and now you are trying to tell us that we don't contribute enough, right?
Ol' Drumpf tries to weasel his way out of his responsibilities. However, what can we expect from a guy whose grandfather lost his German citizenship for being a draft dodger?
Frederick Trump - Wikipedia
In retrospection, I started believing that the Polish FM was right when he made this comment 10 years ago:
Polish Foreign Minister: We Gave The US A "Blowjob," Got Nothing
<b>The latest leaked recording to rock European politics.</b>
Speaking of Germany and France, it's not about the will but the abilities. They don't produce military systems at an acceptable pace to replenish their stocks, let alone give them out to Ukraine in big quantities. Bringing their production levels to the point where they could expand their armies plus donate some spare equipment to other countries will take many years. Certainly, they don't have a fvckton of spare equipment stored in the desert.
Poland started boosting its production capabilities in 2022, but you won't build a tank factory, an IFV factory and an SPG factory plus train workers and get resources to build these vehicles overnight. Furthermore, some percentage of these vehicles will be ordered by Ukraine.
- Joined
- Jun 18, 2019
- Messages
- 5,834
- Points
- 258
There's no reason to give ol' Oli a sh1t for telling the truth. The EU does not have the capability to keep this war going. It's not defeatism. but a factual statement. We have the money but have lost our production capabilities. If the Frenchmen and the Germans are pushed to pay more taxes to support Ukraine, FN and AfD will win the next elections. Both of them are financed by RuZZia. So, it's catch-22.
Ukraine has not announced the general mobilisation, as the brave comedian wants to win the next presidential election. He had been BS-tting his countrymen for months about taking back Crimea and winning the war, ordered to defend Bakhmut and Avdiivka regardless of losses, but Ukraine has not bought any 155mm artillery shells since August 2023. How long do you expect your soldiers to defend your country if they don't have shells?
Last edited:
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2019
- Messages
- 7,973
- Points
- 284
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2019
- Messages
- 7,973
- Points
- 284
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2019
- Messages
- 7,973
- Points
- 284
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2019
- Messages
- 7,973
- Points
- 284
- Joined
- Feb 2, 2018
- Messages
- 8,901
- Points
- 328
I'm not sure I understand your argument. France and Germany shouldn't defend Europe, because Putin would never attack them, so the US should pay to defend Europe???? What?????Are you serious?
Putain has never intended to attack countries like France or Germany. He intends to rebuild the USSR and it's his primary goal.
The NATO countries bordering RuZZia or Belarus are Poland, Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia.
Regarding Poland, we have been spending 2% of our GDP on defence for many years and so has Estonia. Lithuania and Latvia had been taking the piss for many years but got serious in 2022. They reintroduced the draft and increased their spending.
Poland increased its spending from 2% to 4%, the highest percentage in the NATO.
The Polish Army would have looked better not if we had not spent $10bn (it was worth much more 10-15 years ago) on the U.S.-led missions in Iraq and Afghanistan.
So, we had spent 100% of our defence budget on the U.S.-led missions between 2003 and 2022 and were given a lot of sh1t from France and Germany because of participating in the BS mission in Iraq and a lot of sh1t from them for installing the anti-ballistic shield on our territory and now you are trying to tell us that we don't contribute enough, right?
Ol' Drumpf tries to weasel his way out of his responsibilities. However, what can we expect from a guy whose grandfather lost his German citizenship for being a draft dodger?
Needless to say, became rich, earning money from prostitution. If you know that, you cannot be surprised at Drump's comments about women.Frederick Trump - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
In retrospection, I started believing that the Polish FM was right when he made this comment 10 years ago:
Polish Foreign Minister: We Gave The US A "Blowjob," Got Nothing
<b>The latest leaked recording to rock European politics.</b>www.buzzfeednews.com
Speaking of Germany and France, it's not about the will but the abilities. They don't produce military systems at an acceptable pace to replenish their stocks, let alone give them out to Ukraine in big quantities. Bringing their production levels to the point where they could expand their armies plus donate some spare equipment to other countries will take many years. Certainly, they don't have a fvckton of spare equipment stored in the desert.
Poland started boosting its production capabilities in 2022, but you won't build a tank factory, an IFV factory and an SPG factory plus train workers and get resources to build these vehicles overnight. Furthermore, some percentage of these vehicles will be ordered by Ukraine.
Honestly, I didn't read that Wiki entry on Trump's Bavarian ancestor from 1860, I'm not sure what bearing it has on this conversation.
Similar threads
