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Warfare HAMAS attack on Israel, Oct 2023 & Iran’s Proxies.

Damages at Nevatim.

Wow they buried half the Israeli Air Force in those two craters. Iranian missiles are more effective than I had feared.

On a less sarcastic note, Iranian backed proxies blew up the Israeli embassy in Argentina and tried to do the same in London during the 1990's, in each instance with deaths - in the Argentine case dozens of deaths. Their shocked virgin cries of "how dare Israel do this" ring rather hollow.
 
I might be wrong, but, I believe there exists what can be described as a state of war between Israel and Syria (on a pause) for the moment
so any strike on any installation in enemy territory, where the enemy with its allies is known to be located (a enemy, and its like minded allies are in the process of planning immediate or future acts of aggression against Israel and its citizens) is fair game to be targeted.
I stated before but here will repeat Iran is one of the biggest sponsors of terrorism and aggression in the Middle East, their well publicized statement that its ultimate aim is to see the ultimate destruction/ eradication of Israel and its people.

Technically at war, stuck in a state of cease-fire.

A fair number of good-will gestures done these past few years.

But that's pretty much all.
 
Wow they buried half the Israeli Air Force in those two craters. Iranian missiles are more effective than I had feared.

On a less sarcastic note, Iranian backed proxies blew up the Israeli embassy in Argentina and tried to do the same in London during the 1990's, in each instance with deaths - in the Argentine case dozens of deaths. Their shocked virgin cries of "how dare Israel do this" ring rather hollow.

But these were purely terroristic by nature.

The targets were embassies and people in them, they didn't have any strategic value as in: plans for actions against Iran, military assets, sensitive documents, etc... Any other Israeli embassy could have been the target of these attacks.
 
Glad Israel did well last night. Question, wonder if any of the Iranian drones or missiles overshot Israel & hit Gaza? While it was going on last night I kept thinking someone would report at least a few overshot. Here is a short video of minor repairs @ Nevatim AB.
 
The Times of Israel reports 200 missiles and drones were launched, most of which successfully intercepted. Allegedly, no hits were scored in Israel itself. American, British and Jordanian units also shot down some missiles and drones. Iranian officials suggest that they'll leave it at that, but Tel Aviv says that "now it's Iran's turn to go sleepless" against a backdrop of claims that Biden won't back an Israeli counter-attack.

Frankly, Biden might actually be right in this instance. Israel targeted some henchmen of Iran's, Iran retaliated as Israel knew that they would. And the retaliation was ineffective. Israel claims that they successfully repelled the attack with no loss of life or damage to property.

You could argue that that feat in itself is enough of a flex. If nothing has happened, is it really worth striking back in kind and risking a wider war whilst Israel is still busy dealing with Hamas and Hisbullah?

330 weapons used, for a time on target attack, aiming to saturate the defenses.

They must have hoped for 25%, that would be reasonable, surely?

somewhere around 5% maybe less, got through, to strike the base.

Don't think with the white man's head, that's the fabulous East.
. They chose to win because:
- it took a string of countries to unite against their missiles and hit the airbase. They only had to use a fraction of their supplies.
. 24 hours have passed and Israel has not retaliated, plus Washington is doing everything it can to make sure it doesn't.
See also Red Sea, arms shipments to Russia, proxy wars - they can do what they want, no one will stand up to them. So they win.
I agree with @Hiryu2.0 .

Imo it's not about any damage (or lack thereof), that may well have not been the Iranian primary objective given the amount of ordnance fired vs the known strength of the Israeli air defenses, it's about the deterrence being broken down further. Iran has proven that you can attack US military targets (in Iraq, Syria and at sea among others) multiple times without being punished for it in any meaningful way. If the reports about Biden not supporting Israel in any punitive strike they've even been handed the supreme win of the US now even actively degrading the deterrence of their own allies and their ability to react to both Iranian terrorist operations in/by proxies and direct aggression.

It's not how they faired it's that they attacked a close ally of the US to begin with and will get away with it that's the key takeaway here for all strategic opponents.

And I don't want to make this about Biden specifically, many administrations have made large geopolitical mistakes in the region since the end of the Cold War, but Obama and Biden by far reign supreme in this regard imo. During the Obama administration Iran went from laughing stock with their ancient unservicable pre-revolution air force to one of the world's largest producers of all sorts of long range guided missiles, ammunition and UAVs. Look at many of the Iranian missile systems, when they were produced in unseen before mass production: The second Obama term after he had lifted sanctions and returned billions of seized assets to the regime. That was after Obama had been re-newing sanctions against them, adding additional ones, and had been confronted by violent repression of not just the Iranian people for 6 years in office, but the support given to the Syrian regime to butcher their people too. Yet he gave them everything they wanted for nothing in return, changing his opinion seemingly overnight.

Diplomacy does not recognize compassion, kindness and charity, especially not in the Middle East and Asia. Weakness is not a strength, weakness is weakness.

And don't get me started on the retarded Reset button with russia. I bet Vlad & Sergey are still ROFL whenever it's brought up.

Loads more provocations during the Trump administration and what does Biden do? He reverses the Trump administration's actions against Iran, overtly signaling that the US is prepared to do anything to avoid having to confront Iran in any way, economic, diplomatic or military. Whenever Russia, China, Iran or North Korea go for a bout of sabre rattling the US response is to at best put on a token show of force coordinated so as not to cause any actual damage or far more often to move out of the way. Runing out of Afghanistan with his tail between his legs showed pure cowardice. A staged withdrawal from a long time warzone is not a disaster, pulling out with near zero preparation and absolutely zero plan for how things will go afterwards but pure hope is.

Hope is not a plan.

This isn't avoiding conflict, it's boosting confidence and abilities among the aggressors for the next time they choose to engage, to the point where the US either has no more choice on whether or not to ignore it because it directly affects the US (/mainland), or is no longer in the position to counter it in the first place. When the confrontation does come it will be far more costly than it could have been a decade ago or more at that point.

There is at least a certain amount of coordination going on. The spider in the web is clearly China.

As someone here said, can't remember if it was this thread or the Russia/Ukraine one: The west has politicians, but there isn't a single leader among them. And that is imo by design. We don't want strong leaders, they frighten us.

Problems is, they frighten our elected officials too. On the playground the dominant kid is the bully, not the nice guy.
 
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In 74 my wife and I were driving to what today is the new 290 freeway but then it was Hempstead Highway. I was about 3 blocks from the highway and it was just dusk and I came up on a steel manhole cover and pipe that all the pavement in my lane had collapsed around like this first photo. Pinto just nosed down into it when I locked the brakes but it was too late. It ripped out my steering and oil pan and trans oil pan. Did a hard right and into a deep ditch. We both were ok and climbed back out on the street and walked to the Police sub station that was pretty near on the highway side. I told the officer at the desk where the manhole was and he says "oh yeah we know about that one, we lost two cars there already". Heh, I had the car towed to the dealer where I had purchased it and on a Sunday morning I drove over to look it over to see how bad it was, the front main uni body behind the radiator was shoved over at least two inches. I cranked up the engine and put it in gear and held my foot down and finished off the engine. About 7 months later we were sitting at the table having lunch and some guy had found my personal info in the glove box and he ask me if I thought the car was worth fixing. I told him sure, if you can shove that 2 inch alignment of the frame back into shape. Never heard from him again
 
In 74 my wife and I were driving to what today is the new 290 freeway but then it was Hempstead Highway. I was about 3 blocks from the highway and it was just dusk and I came up on a steel manhole cover and pipe that all the pavement in my lane had collapsed around like this first photo. Pinto just nosed down into it when I locked the brakes but it was too late. It ripped out my steering and oil pan and trans oil pan. Did a hard right and into a deep ditch. We both were ok and climbed back out on the street and walked to the Police sub station that was pretty near on the highway side. I told the officer at the desk where the manhole was and he says "oh yeah we know about that one, we lost two cars there already". Heh, I had the car towed to the dealer where I had purchased it and on a Sunday morning I drove over to look it over to see how bad it was, the front main uni body behind the radiator was shoved over at least two inches. I cranked up the engine and put it in gear and held my foot down and finished off the engine. About 7 months later we were sitting at the table having lunch and some guy had found my personal info in the glove box and he ask me if I thought the car was worth fixing. I told him sure, if you can shove that 2 inch alignment of the frame back into shape. Never heard from him again

honestly... i really enjoyed reading this story ..... if you have anymore interesting stories similar to this way posted somewhere ,just share a link with me :)
 
I agree with @Hiryu2.0 .

Imo it's not about any damage (or lack thereof), that may well have not been the Iranian primary objective given the amount of ordnance fired vs the known strength of the Israeli air defenses, it's about the deterrence being broken down further. Iran has proven that you can attack US military targets (in Iraq, Syria and at sea among others) multiple times without being punished for it in any meaningful way. If the reports about Biden not supporting Israel in any punitive strike they've even been handed the supreme win of the US now even actively degrading the deterrence of their own allies and their ability to react to both Iranian terrorist operations in/by proxies and direct aggression.

It's not how they faired it's that they attacked a close ally of the US to begin with and will get away with it that's the key takeaway here for all strategic opponents.

And I don't want to make this about Biden specifically, many administrations have made large geopolitical mistakes in the region since the end of the Cold War, but Obama and Biden by far reign supreme in this regard imo. During the Obama administration Iran went from laughing stock with their ancient unservicable pre-revolution air force to one of the world's largest producers of all sorts of long range guided missiles, ammunition and UAVs. Look at many of the Iranian missile systems, when they were produced in unseen before mass production: The second Obama term after he had lifted sanctions and returned billions of seized assets to the regime. That was after Obama had been re-newing sanctions against them, adding additional ones, and had been confronted by violent repression of not just the Iranian people for 6 years in office, but the support given to the Syrian regime to butcher their people too. Yet he gave them everything they wanted for nothing in return, changing his opinion seemingly overnight.

Diplomacy does not recognize compassion, kindness and charity, especially not in the Middle East and Asia. Weakness is not a strength, weakness is weakness.

And don't get me started on the retarded Reset button with russia. I bet Vlad & Sergey are still ROFL whenever it's brought up.

Loads more provocations during the Trump administration and what does Biden do? He reverses the Trump administration's actions against Iran, overtly signaling that the US is prepared to do anything to avoid having to confront Iran in any way, economic, diplomatic or military. Whenever Russia, China, Iran or North Korea go for a bout of sabre rattling the US response is to at best put on a token show of force coordinated so as not to cause any actual damage or far more often to move out of the way. Runing out of Afghanistan with his tail between his legs showed pure cowardice. A staged withdrawal from a long time warzone is not a disaster, pulling out with near zero preparation and absolutely zero plan for how things will go afterwards but pure hope is.

Hope is not a plan.

This isn't avoiding conflict, it's boosting confidence and abilities among the aggressors for the next time they choose to engage, to the point where the US either has no more choice on whether or not to ignore it because it directly affects the US (/mainland), or is no longer in the position to counter it in the first place. When the confrontation does come it will be far more costly than it could have been a decade ago or more at that point.

There is at least a certain amount of coordination going on. The spider in the web is clearly China.

As someone here said, can't remember if it was this thread or the Russia/Ukraine one: The west has politicians, but there isn't a single leader among them. And that is imo by design. We don't want strong leaders, they frighten us.

Problems is, they frighten our elected officials too. On the playground the dominant kid is the bully, not the nice guy.
In the ME, I'd go with Israel, hit back, hard.

Its easy, when defended by 2 Oceans, to sit back and call for reason, or peace. To be fair, also easy for UK to do so.

In the west, we have moved politically to the centre, so in the UK we have either a high spending Labour party, or a high spending conservative party. We can only hope, that if a war came, they would man up and make the tough decisions. But given how dangerous the world is becoming, I'd like to see some home defence planning take place. We have no missile defence, now they would say we have no threat - fine, but we should have 2-3 units, and then we could lend/train to countries that have a threat.
 
A couple of UK Patriot and THAAD/Arrow batteries wouldn't be a bad thing for you right now. Sea Viper really isn't going to cut it (unless you created some kind of land based version which would be pretty cool).
 
I agree with @Hiryu2.0 .

Imo it's not about any damage (or lack thereof), that may well have not been the Iranian primary objective given the amount of ordnance fired vs the known strength of the Israeli air defenses, it's about the deterrence being broken down further. Iran has proven that you can attack US military targets (in Iraq, Syria and at sea among others) multiple times without being punished for it in any meaningful way. If the reports about Biden not supporting Israel in any punitive strike they've even been handed the supreme win of the US now even actively degrading the deterrence of their own allies and their ability to react to both Iranian terrorist operations in/by proxies and direct aggression.

It's not how they faired it's that they attacked a close ally of the US to begin with and will get away with it that's the key takeaway here for all strategic opponents.

And I don't want to make this about Biden specifically, many administrations have made large geopolitical mistakes in the region since the end of the Cold War, but Obama and Biden by far reign supreme in this regard imo. During the Obama administration Iran went from laughing stock with their ancient unservicable pre-revolution air force to one of the world's largest producers of all sorts of long range guided missiles, ammunition and UAVs. Look at many of the Iranian missile systems, when they were produced in unseen before mass production: The second Obama term after he had lifted sanctions and returned billions of seized assets to the regime. That was after Obama had been re-newing sanctions against them, adding additional ones, and had been confronted by violent repression of not just the Iranian people for 6 years in office, but the support given to the Syrian regime to butcher their people too. Yet he gave them everything they wanted for nothing in return, changing his opinion seemingly overnight.

Diplomacy does not recognize compassion, kindness and charity, especially not in the Middle East and Asia. Weakness is not a strength, weakness is weakness.

And don't get me started on the retarded Reset button with russia. I bet Vlad & Sergey are still ROFL whenever it's brought up.

Loads more provocations during the Trump administration and what does Biden do? He reverses the Trump administration's actions against Iran, overtly signaling that the US is prepared to do anything to avoid having to confront Iran in any way, economic, diplomatic or military. Whenever Russia, China, Iran or North Korea go for a bout of sabre rattling the US response is to at best put on a token show of force coordinated so as not to cause any actual damage or far more often to move out of the way. Runing out of Afghanistan with his tail between his legs showed pure cowardice. A staged withdrawal from a long time warzone is not a disaster, pulling out with near zero preparation and absolutely zero plan for how things will go afterwards but pure hope is.

Hope is not a plan.

This isn't avoiding conflict, it's boosting confidence and abilities among the aggressors for the next time they choose to engage, to the point where the US either has no more choice on whether or not to ignore it because it directly affects the US (/mainland), or is no longer in the position to counter it in the first place. When the confrontation does come it will be far more costly than it could have been a decade ago or more at that point.

There is at least a certain amount of coordination going on. The spider in the web is clearly China.

As someone here said, can't remember if it was this thread or the Russia/Ukraine one: The west has politicians, but there isn't a single leader among them. And that is imo by design. We don't want strong leaders, they frighten us.

Problems is, they frighten our elected officials too. On the playground the dominant kid is the bully, not the nice guy.
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It is still amazing to me just how little understanding of us they have. Case in point, the moron thinks that this is supposed to scare or intimidate us... in reality, the reaction of an average Israeli is going to be anywhere between amused indifference (especially after the recent dud) to being pissed off and supporting an even more aggressive stance against Iran. Yep, keep helping Bibi, you effin' idiot...
 


The Persians are aware that their ambitions won't materialize, yet they persist in their actions. Why? Well, it seems that expressing animosity towards Israel and the US has become a cultural norm . It's reminiscent of the Cold War era rhetoric like "We will bury you." It appears they're left with little else to do than engage in such nonsensical talk, which costs them nothing.
 
The Persians are aware that their ambitions won't materialize, yet they persist in their actions. Why? Well, it seems that expressing animosity towards Israel and the US has become a cultural norm . It's reminiscent of the Cold War era rhetoric like "We will bury you." It appears they're left with little else to do than engage in such nonsensical talk, which costs them nothing.
It's all good and fine... but this particular message was in Hebrew, specifically addressed to the Israeli public. Other than pathological level of delusion, I don't have any explanation for this.
 

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